Changes to the Retirement and Re-employment Act represent official acknowledgement that most current white collar work is knowledge or technology based. Employees are theoretically able to continue their careers well into their sixties.
Likely GLCs and local SMEs having this out- dated mindset and unable to embrace the fact that Singapore is aging. Instead of strategising, I am sure they blamed MOM for implementing Compass Framework.
(17-06-2024, 07:00 AM)Bigiron Wrote: [ -> ]OPINION | What’s wrong with employing people over 40 in the office? It ain’t over till the fat lady sings, you know
https://theindependent.sg/opinion-whats-...-you-know/
ageism in employment can be solved easily.
but PAP govt refuses to provide funding to solve it.
PAP govt just need to provide free trainings and industry certifications to train people over 40 for the job market.
As an employer, I will prefer a well trained and certified person with advanced certfifications lasting at least a year than to train a fresh graduate
for 1 year by myself.
Will PAP govt provide funding of at least 1 year to train the over 40 people ?
(17-06-2024, 08:28 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]ageism in employment can be solved easily.
but PAP govt refuses to provide funding to solve it.
PAP govt just need to provide free trainings and industry certifications to train people over 40 for the job market.
As an employer, I will prefer a well trained and certified person with advanced certfifications lasting at least a year than to train a fresh graduate
for 1 year by myself.
Will PAP govt provide funding of at least 1 year to train the over 40 people ?
ageism is a bias by employers who think that older people are outdated and cannot be trained for the job.
the govt needs to provide funding to the older people to prove that they are more well trained than fresh gradautes.
the govt need to combat ageism with training so that older people are more than well trained than the job requirements.
(17-06-2024, 08:28 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]ageism in employment can be solved easily.
but PAP govt refuses to provide funding to solve it.
PAP govt just need to provide free trainings and industry certifications to train people over 40 for the job market.
As an employer, I will prefer a well trained and certified person with advanced certfifications lasting at least a year than to train a fresh graduate
for 1 year by myself.
Will PAP govt provide funding of at least 1 year to train the over 40 people ?
Talk is very easy. You think money drop from the sky?
(17-06-2024, 08:52 PM)Blasterlord2 Wrote: [ -> ]Talk is very easy. You think money drop from the sky?
if training is the solution to ageism, and you want to solve it, money is inevitable.
you can choose to ignore the problem or solve it.
if you need to wait for money to drop, you can choose to ignore all problems
(17-06-2024, 08:52 PM)Blasterlord2 Wrote: [ -> ]Talk is very easy. You think money drop from the sky?
what is your solution to ageism ?
keep quiet or wait for money to drop from sky ?
(17-06-2024, 09:05 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]if training is the solution to ageism, and you want to solve it, money is inevitable.
you can choose to ignore the problem or solve it.
if you need to wait for money to drop, you can choose to ignore all problems
Not sure if training is the solution.
How can you ensure the course has not been taken up by younger working population.
Anyway Spore median working age around ~42to 43 is pulled down by younger PRs
Actual figure will be close to 50.
So most Sporeans will face ageism when they start looking for new job.
How can crate so many different courses for so many people. you cannot expect all to
take same few courses.
(17-06-2024, 09:07 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]what is your solution to ageism ?
keep quiet or wait for money to drop from sky ?
The govt already has given out some money for training, and those over 40s get more. But what do you think is the takeup rate?
I dun have a solution. It's a worldwide problem that no country has a solution to. Of cos training those over 40s is one of the solutions, but many sinkies aren't really very open to it, if not the takeup rate of skillsfuture will be high liao.
There is a need to fundamentally change our employment system and pay structure, such that less emphasis is given to degree, but more on skills, such as plumbing and other crafts etc, so that we do not need to over rely on foreigners. But it's not so easy, since cheap foreign labour is so readily available that the govt rather get them do these jobs and let sinkies do "higher value" work. However, from my dealings with sinkies at work, most aren't good enough. They are not worthy of their degree. So the end result is, let them feel the pain.
(17-06-2024, 09:19 PM)watchfirst9 Wrote: [ -> ]Not sure if training is the solution.
How can you ensure the course has not been taken up by younger working population.
Anyway Spore median working age around ~42to 43 is pulled down by younger PRs
Actual figure will be close to 50.
So most Sporeans will face ageism when they start looking for new job.
How can crate so many different courses for so many people. you cannot expect all to
take same few courses.
there are many solutions, training is definitely the solution.
a senior and a fresh graduate come to you for a job.
why would you employ the senior ?
this senior must be better trained than the fresh graduate for the job so that he can contribute in the shortest time.
for simple example, you need a delivery guy.
the fresh graduate can only drive a car.
this senior is trained to drive a car, a motorcycle and a lorry.
I will employ this senior because he can drive my car, my motorcycle and my lorry for delivery.
the purpose is to train the above 40 people to appeal to the employees to combat ageism.
this person is older and faces ageism but the govt trains him to be multi-skilled or deep-skilled for the employers to combat ageism.
of course, the fresh graduate who does not face ageism, he has to fund and train himself .
(17-06-2024, 09:28 PM)Blasterlord2 Wrote: [ -> ]The govt already has given out some money for training, and those over 40s get more. But what do you think is the takeup rate?
the problem with skillsfuture courses is that it is too general to appeal to the employers.
the big employers have to come in and tell the govt what they want from the courses so that the trained person will meet their specialised requirements.
(17-06-2024, 09:28 PM)Blasterlord2 Wrote: [ -> ]I dun have a solution. It's a worldwide problem that no country has a solution to. Of cos training those over 40s is one of the solutions, but many sinkies aren't really very open to it, if not the takeup rate of skillsfuture will be high liao.
There is a need to fundamentally change our employment system and pay structure, such that less emphasis is given to degree, but more on skills, such as plumbing and other crafts etc, so that we do not need to over rely on foreigners. But it's not so easy, since cheap foreign labour is so readily available that the govt rather get them do these jobs and let sinkies do "higher value" work. However, from my dealings with sinkies at work, most aren't good enough. They are not worthy of their degree. So the end result is, let them feel the pain.
your above comments have nothing to do with ageism.
it is more about import of foreign talents.
only PAP will allow the hiring of their own kind
other than that, is none of their business
pap will import anyone younger to replace these
and so what the fück can you do about it?
whine entire day entire week entire month entire year?
too bad, you are born a stinkaporean
(17-06-2024, 09:51 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]the problem with skillsfuture courses is that it is too general to appeal to the employers.
the big employers have to come in and tell the govt what they want from the courses so that the trained person will meet their specialised requirements.
Your so-called "big" employers are already doing it. Big companies have a budget to train their staff. It's the staff who are not willing to go through the training.
(17-06-2024, 09:52 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]your above comments have nothing to do with ageism.
it is more about import of foreign talents.
Everything is connected. If you dun even understand this simply logic, there's no use explaining to you.
(17-06-2024, 09:43 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]there are many solutions, training is definitely the solution.
a senior and a fresh graduate come to you for a job.
why would you employ the senior ?
this senior must be better trained than the fresh graduate for the job so that he can contribute in the shortest time.
for simple example, you need a delivery guy.
the fresh graduate can only drive a car.
this senior is trained to drive a car, a motorcycle and a lorry.
I will employ this senior because he can drive my car, my motorcycle and my lorry for delivery.
the purpose is to train the above 40 people to appeal to the employees to combat ageism.
this person is older and faces ageism but the govt trains him to be multi-skilled or deep-skilled for the employers to combat ageism.
of course, the fresh graduate who does not face ageism, he has to fund and train himself .
for example, why sometimes people prefer to buy from an old man frying char kway teow than a young man frying char kway teow.
because the old man skill and food are better even it is more expensive !
Younger people do not have the depth in experience but are preferred
So sending people in their 50 or 60s for training does not help most of the time
The problem is that the useless MOM had given free flow of FTs for 25 years
(17-06-2024, 09:58 PM)forum456 Wrote: [ -> ]for example, why sometimes people prefer to buy from an old man frying char kway teow than a young man frying char kway teow.
because the old man skill and food are better even it is more expensive !
That one needs experience wor. You try sending him on a one-month course and see if his business is still good.
So, in essence, it's good to have someone over 40s to have a good skill, but he should be trained and he should use this trained skills during his employment years. Once he's out of job, his training won't be enough as there's little chance that he'll be employed simply because he attended some course. Unfortunately, I can tell from my experience that most people are not willing to upgrade themselves when they're still employed.
(17-06-2024, 06:53 PM)EvertonDiehard Wrote: [ -> ]Changes to the Retirement and Re-employment Act represent official acknowledgement that most current white collar work is knowledge or technology based. Employees are theoretically able to continue their careers well into their sixties.
The civil service is retaining older workers. Most peepur don't walk inside MOM, MOE and various ministries and don't know just how many of the staff are actually seniors. There are not enough yang peepur to replace them. The government keeps pushing the retirement age because otherwise the civil service will also have to hire FTs and FWs in large numbers.
One place that is quite open to the public would be community centres or clubs. The staff at the CC near where I live are mostly lau funties and lau funkers. One uncle is already bald headed with a bit of hair around the skull. The other one has hair but it's all white.
In the private sector, they place a premium on image. It looks good to put yang and fresh looking peepur at the front of the house and even in the main office. When you reach a certain age, you'd look dignified sitting inside a room of your own. If you are still sitting in the general office occupying just a table.... call it ageism if you like, but will you hire an old man or lau chabor if you are the boss of your own company? Be honest...
everyone will pass 40 one day. so those young employers becareful of what you want.
let goodness go around so that goodness come around.