[Ali Imran]

There were libraries before Muhammad's time...people read, information spreads

In Madinah? LOL

And you said you're well-informed.

[pinkpanther]

In Madinah? LOL

And you said you're well-informed.

People acquire knowledge by reading and learning from libraries, and Muhammad may have gained insights from those who read and stay around him.

You give the whole library to Muhammad also useless because he can't read...but he has wars to listen to news

[Ali Imran]

People acquire knowledge by reading and learning from libraries, and Muhammad may have gained insights from those who read and stay around him.

You give the whole library to Muhammad also useless because he can't read...but he has wars to listen to news

So you mean the information in the Quran was given to Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم by those around him, and he put it in the Quran. And then he claimed that it was a revelation from God, and they all believed him?

Did you engage your brain before coming up with that nonsense?

[pinkpanther]

So you mean the information in the Quran was given to Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم by those around him, and he put it in the Quran. And then he claimed that it was a revelation from God, and they all believed him?

Did you engage your brain before coming up with that nonsense?

You don even know your prophet that well  are you a real moslem...he knew about the jews and christians..that is without a doubt..and he knew more than what the jews and Christians believe in....what do you think? He kept himself in the room all year round? ....

AI Overview



+23
Prophet Muhammad learned from various individuals and sources throughout his life, both before and after receiving his prophethood. He learned from his own experiences, his interactions with others, and through divine revelation. His experiences included being orphaned at a young age, working as a shepherd, and engaging in trade, all of which contributed to his understanding of the world and its people. He also learned from his wife Khadijah, his companions, and through listening to the advice of others.

[pinkpanther]

So you mean the information in the Quran was given to Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم by those around him, and he put it in the Quran. And then he claimed that it was a revelation from God, and they all believed him?

Did you engage your brain before coming up with that nonsense?

Who said the revelation was from God? ..it was from an entity claiming to be Jibril...God never pass him the revelation directly!

[Ali Imran]

Who said the revelation was from God? ..it was from an entity claiming to be Jibril...God never pass him the revelation directly!

Read again what I wrote. See if you can realize how silly your claim is.

[pinkpanther]

Read again what I wrote. See if you can realize how silly your claim is.

There is nothing silly about my claim....it is silly you chose to believe in a man who claimed to receive God's revelation..... again all claims no proof no evidences no witnesses...just hot air

[pinkpanther]

Read again what I wrote. See if you can realize how silly your claim is.

You know why the Quran is not from God? Muhammad makes a wrong claim about the Trinity!
Show me from your Quran that when it talked about the Trinity..it is talking about the Father, son and the Holy spirit!!! Not Mary!!! Muhammad got it wrongly from the catholics!

AI Overview



+5
The Quran does not present the Christian concept of the Trinity as one God in three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Instead, some Quranic verses appear to address a misunderstanding of the Trinity, sometimes associating it with a belief in God, Jesus, and Mary as separate deities. Muslims believe in the absolute oneness of God (Tawhid) and reject the idea of a Trinity that includes multiple divine beings.

[Ali Imran]

There is nothing silly about my claim....it is silly you chose to believe in a man who claimed to receive God's revelation..... again all claims no proof no evidences no witnesses...just hot air

Pretend you're the companion and I'm the prophet.

You told me something I didn't know: that the universe is expanding and every living thing originates from water. And then I put it in a book and claim that I received that info from God. Would you know that I am lying about getting that info from God?

Now can you see how silly your claim is?

[Ali Imran]

You know why the Quran is not from God? Muhammad makes a wrong claim about the Trinity!
Show me from your Quran that when it talked about the Trinity..it is talking about the Father, son and the Holy spirit!!! Not Mary!!! Muhammad got it wrongly from the catholics!

AI Overview



+5
The Quran does not present the Christian concept of the Trinity as one God in three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Instead, some Quranic verses appear to address a misunderstanding of the Trinity, sometimes associating it with a belief in God, Jesus, and Mary as separate deities. Muslims believe in the absolute oneness of God (Tawhid) and reject the idea of a Trinity that includes multiple divine beings.

You have every right to disbelieve Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم was a messenger of God. I don't mind even a bit. But you cannot come up with an intellectual argument to support your disbelieve in him.

No, the Quran did not get the Trinity wrong. You are wrong, not the Quran.

[pinkpanther]

Pretend you're the companion and I'm the prophet.

You told me something I didn't know: that the universe is expanding and every living thing originates from water. And then I put it in a book and claim that I received that info from God. Would you know that I am lying about getting that info from God?

Now can you see how silly your claim is?

Your thinking is as backwards as Islam ..who says that Muhammad needs to be fed infomation from his companions  ...he was once a merchant and travelled on trading trips. He is bound to meet, listen and learn from people of all sorts from some market places..He remembered some stories and put it in the Quran..

AI Overview

Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) was known for his wisdom and leadership, and his interactions with those around him played a crucial role in his personal and spiritual development. He learned from the people he encountered, including his family, companions, and even his opponents, by observing their actions, listening to their opinions, and engaging in discussions. 

[pinkpanther]

No, the Quran did not get the Trinity wrong. You are wrong, not the Quran.

The Quran talks about the Trinity ..show me that the Quran got the 3 persons of the Trinity right! 
It never gets anything right!!

[pinkpanther]

Apparently, Muhammad also guaranteed salvation 

Sahih al-Bukhari 6807
Narrated Sahl bin Sa`d:

The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Whoever guarantees me (the chastity of) what is between his legs (i.e. his private parts), and what is between his jaws (i.e., his tongue), I guarantee him Paradise."

What does this mean? If you are a virgin, you go to heaven?

[Ali Imran]

The Quran talks about the Trinity ..show me that the Quran got the 3 persons of the Trinity right! 
It never gets anything right!!

Show me where the Quran gets it wrong about the Trinity.

[Ali Imran]

Your thinking is as backwards as Islam ..who says that Muhammad needs to be fed infomation from his companions  ...he was once a merchant and travelled on trading trips. He is bound to meet, listen and learn from people of all sorts from some market places..He remembered some stories and put it in the Quran..

AI Overview

Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) was known for his wisdom and leadership, and his interactions with those around him played a crucial role in his personal and spiritual development. He learned from the people he encountered, including his family, companions, and even his opponents, by observing their actions, listening to their opinions, and engaging in discussions. 

You're the one who said Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم got the information about the expanding universe from his companions. 

Are you backtracking now?

[Ali Imran]

Apparently, Muhammad also guaranteed salvation 

Sahih al-Bukhari 6807
Narrated Sahl bin Sa`d:

The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Whoever guarantees me (the chastity of) what is between his legs (i.e. his private parts), and what is between his jaws (i.e., his tongue), I guarantee him Paradise."

What does this mean? If you are a virgin, you go to heaven?

If you have half the brain, you can understand that simple Hadith.

[pinkpanther]

You're the one who said Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم got the information about the expanding universe from his companions. 

Are you backtracking now?

Islam is depraving your ability to think..who says that Muhammad only got his information from his companions ....he gets everything from his life experiences...* Eyes roll up*

[Ali Imran]

Islam is depraving your ability to think..who says that Muhammad only got his information from his companions ....he gets everything from his life experiences...* Eyes roll up*

So you're backtracking what you said just last night.

Ok noted.

[pinkpanther]

If you have half the brain, you can understand that simple Hadith.

So you tell me about this simple Hadith!! How to go to jannah with what is in between the legs

[Ali Imran]

So you tell me about this simple Hadith!! How to go to jannah with what is in between the legs

Easy.

Maintain chastity.

[pinkpanther]

So you're backtracking what you said just last night.

Ok noted.

What backtracking....you literally just think that Muhammad can only learn from his companions ...

Your brains can no longer open to other options and explanations

[pinkpanther]

Easy.

Maintain chastity.

So an ugly virgin with a corrupted mind can go to jannah?

[Ali Imran]

What backtracking....you literally just think that Muhammad can only learn from his companions ...

Of course not. I would never said that.

But you said it. You said the companions fed the prophet with scientific information that is found in the Quran.

[Ali Imran]

So an ugly virgin with a corrupted mind can go to jannah?

How small is your mind?

[pinkpanther]

Of course not. I would never said that.

But you said it. You said the companions fed the prophet with scientific information that is found in the Quran.

Just because I said that, you don rule out other possibilities of where he gets his information from...it can be from his collection of life experiences....* Eyes roll up*

[pinkpanther]

How small is your mind?

So the virgins went up to jannah and what is their rewards? More virgins for them?

[Ali Imran]

Just because I said that, you don rule out other possibilities of where he gets his information from...it can be from his collection of life experiences....* Eyes roll up*

How does life experience give him the information about the expanding universe?

[pinkpanther]

How does life experience give him the information about the expanding universe?

Let's not get carried with all this prediction...it means nothing for our salvation 

Is it true 1400 years ago the Quran talked about the expansion of the universe?

No, this is another Quote battle, where in this case we are expected to interpret old Arab into English and the problem is that Arab words have sometimes more than 1 possible meaning.

The verse is Quran 51:47

Abdullah Yusuf Ali; Quran 51:47. With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of pace.

This does not look as expansion, but later translations, after the Hubble confirmation of an expanding universe, used a different word:

Sahih International; Quran 51:47. And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander.

We must however consider that even if the Arab word Musi'un can also mean expand, where it has always meant vastness, the change of meaning is a bit opportunistic. Had the universe not been shown to be expanding, the term vastness would have been used in modern translations.

While there is a debate whether Musi'un can mean expand, there is agreement that it can certainly mean vastness.

The Quran had the whole ordering of sun, moon and stars in the heavens completely wrong. This means that any scientific credibility regarding cosmology is already destroyed before you should wonder what the word Musi'un may have meant. It was just the word used to explain that the heavens were created above the earth.

Just look at the next verse

Sahih International; Quran 51:48 And the earth We have spread out, and excellent is the preparer

So we spread the earth and expanded the heavens, but this text does not say the earth is still spreading or that the heavens are still expanding. That is just opportunistic pseudo-science applied to the texts from a book that has most of the other scientific facts concerning cosmology completely wrong.

Just to show how hard it is to read old Arab and make sense of it, look at some more translations of that verse from respectable translators:

Abdul Majid Daryabadi
And the heaven! We have built it with might, and verily We are powerful.
Hilali & Khan
With power did We construct the heaven. Verily, We are Able to extend the vastness of space thereof.
Mohammed Habib Shakir
And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample.
Qaribullah & Darwish
We built the heaven with might, and We widely extended it.
Shah Faridul Haque
And We have built the heaven with hands (the Divine Power), and it is We Who give the expanse.
Talal Itani
We constructed the universe with power, and We are expanding it.
Wahiduddin Khan
We built the universe with Our might, giving it its vast expanse.

It is a bit a mix of things, but it surely shows that there is a lot of room for interpreting old Arab texts. To just pick one translation and to claim a specific word in it means something is not reasonable

[Ali Imran]

Let's not get carried with all this prediction...it means nothing for our salvation 

Is it true 1400 years ago the Quran talked about the expansion of the universe?

No, this is another Quote battle, where in this case we are expected to interpret old Arab into English and the problem is that Arab words have sometimes more than 1 possible meaning.

The verse is Quran 51:47

Abdullah Yusuf Ali; Quran 51:47. With power and skill did We construct the Firmament: for it is We Who create the vastness of pace.

This does not look as expansion, but later translations, after the Hubble confirmation of an expanding universe, used a different word:

Sahih International; Quran 51:47. And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander.

We must however consider that even if the Arab word Musi'un can also mean expand, where it has always meant vastness, the change of meaning is a bit opportunistic. Had the universe not been shown to be expanding, the term vastness would have been used in modern translations.

While there is a debate whether Musi'un can mean expand, there is agreement that it can certainly mean vastness.

The Quran had the whole ordering of sun, moon and stars in the heavens completely wrong. This means that any scientific credibility regarding cosmology is already destroyed before you should wonder what the word Musi'un may have meant. It was just the word used to explain that the heavens were created above the earth.

Just look at the next verse

Sahih International; Quran 51:48 And the earth We have spread out, and excellent is the preparer

So we spread the earth and expanded the heavens, but this text does not say the earth is still spreading or that the heavens are still expanding. That is just opportunistic pseudo-science applied to the texts from a book that has most of the other scientific facts concerning cosmology completely wrong.

Just to show how hard it is to read old Arab and make sense of it, look at some more translations of that verse from respectable translators:

Abdul Majid Daryabadi
And the heaven! We have built it with might, and verily We are powerful.
Hilali & Khan
With power did We construct the heaven. Verily, We are Able to extend the vastness of space thereof.
Mohammed Habib Shakir
And the heaven, We raised it high with power, and most surely We are the makers of things ample.
Qaribullah & Darwish
We built the heaven with might, and We widely extended it.
Shah Faridul Haque
And We have built the heaven with hands (the Divine Power), and it is We Who give the expanse.
Talal Itani
We constructed the universe with power, and We are expanding it.
Wahiduddin Khan
We built the universe with Our might, giving it its vast expanse.

It is a bit a mix of things, but it surely shows that there is a lot of room for interpreting old Arab texts. To just pick one translation and to claim a specific word in it means something is not reasonable

So, the verse becomes even more accurate in the light of modern science. Cool.

The question is: where did Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم get that information from, if we are to go by your claim that the author of the Quran is Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم?

[pinkpanther]

So, the verse becomes even more accurate in the light of modern science. Cool.

The question is: where did Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم get that information from, if we are to go by your claim that the author of the Quran is Muhammad صلي الله عليه وسلم?

Don be foolish!

the verse is often interpreted as referring to the sky, not the entire universe, and is seen as a description of God's creative power rather than a prediction of the expanding universe....