[Lukongsimi]

https://youtube.com/shorts/NF5Hpt3IknI?s...VurSjDFzaQ

[Hope]

https://youtu.be/PvTzvf58xBI?si=8IU0nAmHztJDoeAB


Paul invented Christianity

[Ali Imran]

In football terms, this is a dangerous tackle but not enough to get send off!

I did not lose the debate ...I'm showing you that a sinless Jesus came with a purpose...you don let that sinless self go to waste

So, the Bible says God abhors human sacrifice.

And then the Bible says God sacrificed a human.

How is that not a contradiction?

[Ali Imran]

God resides in human 
That is why needs a virgin woman to bear Him

The Bible says the entire universe cannot contain God, but you believe God resides in a human body.

How come?

[pinkpanther]

So, the Bible says God abhors human sacrifice.

And then the Bible says God sacrificed a human.

How is that not a contradiction?

The key difference is that this act is not an act of human sacrifice in the sense of ritual offering to pagan gods.... but rather a voluntary act of love and sacrifice by Jesus, with God's ultimate approval and purpose.

[Hope]

https://youtu.be/9I7ysgpx7Jk?si=cRgEbg3EBgpN8NZk


Gospel are fake

[pinkpanther]

https://youtu.be/9I7ysgpx7Jk?si=cRgEbg3EBgpN8NZk

So where is the injil?

[Ali Imran]

The key difference is that this act is not an act of human sacrifice in the sense of ritual offering to pagan gods.... but rather a voluntary act of love and sacrifice by Jesus, with God's ultimate approval and purpose.

Of course we don't consider the Father as a pagan god, and the sacrifice wasn't humans' doing. God himself sacrificed a human, according to your belief.

[Hope]

So where is the injil?

On the day of Judgement,Jesus will tell every one what happened to injil given to him.

[pinkpanther]

Of course we don't consider the Father as a pagan god, and the sacrifice wasn't humans' doing. God himself sacrificed a human, according to your belief.

Instead of humans sacrificing humans to God, God sacrifices His son on the cross to atone for the sins of humanity....so that no more deaths are required..

Jesus is sinless and He bore the sins of the world upon himself during his crucifixion. That is is purpose...you tạke a look at Jesus of Islam...He did not fulfill his purpose , there is no point making him sinless if Allah didnt utilise that nature...

[pinkpanther]

On the day of Judgement,Jesus will tell every one what happened to injil given to him.

But Allah already said in the Quran that the injil is with the Christians and they are reading it...Is Allah joking?

[Ali Imran]

Instead of humans sacrificing humans to God, God sacrifices His son on the cross to atone for the sins of humanity....so that no more deaths are required..

Jesus is sinless and He bore the sins of the world upon himself during his crucifixion. That is is purpose...you tạke a look at Jesus of Islam...He did not fulfill his purpose , there is no point making him sinless if Allah didnt utilise that nature...

So there. You believe God sacrificed a human, even though the Bible says God abhors human sacrifice.

You have to live with that contradiction if you want to believe in that narrative.

[Hope]

But Allah already said in the Quran that the injil is with the Christians and they are reading it...Is Allah joking?

It is with Christian with plus and minus.

Can you explain these two verses ?




Isaiah 26:19 
But your dead will live, Lord;
    their bodies will rise—
let those who dwell in the dust
    wake up and shout for joy—
your dew is like the dew of the morning;
    the earth will give birth to her dead

Job 14:12
so he lies down and does not rise;
    till the heavens are no more, people will not awake
    or be roused from their sleep.

[Ali Imran]

But Allah already said in the Quran that the injil is with the Christians and they are reading it...Is Allah joking?

Do you have the Gospels in your Bible?

[pinkpanther]

But Allah already said in the Quran that the injil is with the Christians and they are reading it...Is Allah joking?

Quran 5:47

وَلْيَحْكُمْ أَهْلُ ٱلْإِنجِيلِ بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فِيهِ ۚ وَمَن لَّمْ يَحْكُم بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فَأُو۟لَـٰٓئِكَ هُمُ ٱلْفَـٰسِقُونَ ٤٧

So let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah has revealed in it. And those who do not judge by what Allah has revealed are ˹truly˺ the rebellious

If you go to this tafsir ...you will have a headache reading the commentaries..

https://quranx.com/tafsirs/5.47

[pinkpanther]

Do you have the Gospels in your Bible?

Yes

[Ali Imran]

Quran 5:47

وَلْيَحْكُمْ أَهْلُ ٱلْإِنجِيلِ بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فِيهِ ۚ وَمَن لَّمْ يَحْكُم بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فَأُو۟لَـٰٓئِكَ هُمُ ٱلْفَـٰسِقُونَ ٤٧

So let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah has revealed in it. And those who do not judge by what Allah has revealed are ˹truly˺ the rebellious

If you go to this tafsir ...you will have a headache reading the commentaries..

https://quranx.com/tafsirs/5.47

I understand it by just plain reading. The Injeel is what comes out of the mouth of the son of Mary, pbuh. That is what Allah revealed.

Let me ask you a simple question. The opening lines of Luke, where the author wrote about why he is writing that book. Do you think Jesus spoke that?

[pinkpanther]

It is with Christian with plus and minus.

Can you explain these two verses ?




Isaiah 26:19 
But your dead will live, Lord;
    their bodies will rise—
let those who dwell in the dust
    wake up and shout for joy—
your dew is like the dew of the morning;
    the earth will give birth to her dead

Job 14:12
so he lies down and does not rise;
    till the heavens are no more, people will not awake
    or be roused from their sleep.

Isaiah 26:19 speaks of the dead who will get resurrected and live again

Job 14:12 It says  that once a person dies, they will not rise again until the heavens are no more

[Hope]

So where is the injil?

On the day of Judgement,Jesus will tell every one what happened to injil given to him.

Quran 5:47

وَلْيَحْكُمْ أَهْلُ ٱلْإِنجِيلِ بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فِيهِ ۚ وَمَن لَّمْ يَحْكُم بِمَآ أَنزَلَ ٱللَّهُ فَأُو۟لَـٰٓئِكَ هُمُ ٱلْفَـٰسِقُونَ ٤٧

So let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah has revealed in it. And those who do not judge by what Allah has revealed are ˹truly˺ the rebellious

If you go to this tafsir ...you will have a headache reading the commentaries..

https://quranx.com/tafsirs/5.47

https://youtu.be/w44qB_Z6q8w?si=jMcNLneFtn0DPN-S

https://youtu.be/qGW5UQHuerU?si=7hijJ8q3UO-23Gya

https://youtu.be/W3zc1GwUFFE?si=JKdCgXgObZWJOHsZ

[pinkpanther]

I understand it by just plain reading. The Injeel is what comes out of the mouth of the son of Mary, pbuh. That is what Allah revealed.

Let me ask you a simple question. The opening lines of Luke, where the author wrote about why he is writing that book. Do you think Jesus spoke that?

No, it's a biography of Jesus. It includes some of His speeches, but there's no need to feature all of His words. Instead, it can present the events of Jesus’s life in a more vivid and engaging manner, focusing on how He led His life rather than solely relying on His direct speeches.

[Hope]

Isaiah 26:19 speaks of the dead who will get resurrected and live again

Job 14:12 It says  that once a person dies, they will not rise again until the heavens are no more

Isn’t contradicting ?

[pinkpanther]

I understand it by just plain reading. The Injeel is what comes out of the mouth of the son of Mary, pbuh. That is what Allah revealed.

I also understand it by own interpretation but the scholars have different opinions...one of them even went to book of Matthew to make a point...

So tell me...what is Allah saying?

[pinkpanther]

Isn’t contradicting ?

No. Job 14:12 speaks of the finality of death from a human perspective, Isaiah 26:19 prophesies a future resurrection. ...

[Ali Imran]

No, it's a biography of Jesus. It includes some of His speeches, but there's no need to feature all of His words. Instead, it can present the events of Jesus’s life in a more vivid and engaging manner, focusing on how He led His life rather than solely relying on His direct speeches.

Ok. So we are clear now. The Injeel is what came out of the mouth of Jesus, pbuh.

[Ali Imran]

So tell me...what is Allah saying?

Exactly what is in the Quran.

Those opening lines of Luke, that didn't come out of the mouth of Jesus. Ergo, Allah didn't reveal that.

[pinkpanther]

Ok. So we are clear now. The Injeel is what came out of the mouth of Jesus, pbuh.

Yes, the Injil was recorded by His disciples and written in a form of biography..

[Ali Imran]

Yes, the Injil was recorded by His disciples and written in a form of biography..

I doubt that very much. 

Scholars opined that the earliest of the 4 Gospels was written decades after Jesus ascended.

[pinkpanther]

Exactly what is in the Quran.

Those opening lines of Luke, that didn't come out of the mouth of Jesus. Ergo, Allah didn't reveal that.

Luke is writing the life and teachings of Jesus..he is a detective and he mentions relying on "those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word" (Luke 1:2), suggesting he sought out and incorporated firsthand accounts.

[Hope]

No. Job 14:12 speaks of the finality of death from a human perspective, Isaiah 26:19 prophesies a future resurrection. ...

As per both ,No more resurrection ?

[pinkpanther]

I doubt that very much. 

Scholars opined that the earliest of the 4 Gospels was written decades after Jesus ascended.

So does this impact the authenticity of the books?