[Ali Imran]

Dear Lukongsimi.

I've asked SimTan to show me where Jesus ever taught people to pray to him. He could not show me.

As you know, we can find in the NT where Jesus taught people to pray directly to God.

So, why do you pray to Jesus instead?

[Lukongsimi]

“I am the way, the truth, and the life” is a statement made by Jesus in the Bible, John 14:6. It is one of Jesus' “I Am” statements

 The Father and Jesus are one.
The Alpha and the omega 
The first and the last 

“Jesus answered: “Don’t you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Don’t you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me?
John 14/9..👍👏👏

[Lukongsimi]

Jesus has invited, urged, and commanded us to pray in his name and has promised incredible results. John 14:13-14 and John 16:23-24 are some of the most powerful verses in all of scripture related to prayer. In fact, when most of us pray we conclude with the phrase, "in Jesus' name."

[pinkpanther]

That moslem is not well read...Stephen prayed to who?

Acts 7:59-60
New International Version
59 While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60 Then he fell on his knees and cried out, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” When he had said this, he fell asleep

Philippians 2:10-11 New King James Version (NKJV)
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

[Ali Imran]

Jesus has invited, urged, and commanded us to pray in his name and has promised incredible results. John 14:13-14 and John 16:23-24 are some of the most powerful verses in all of scripture related to prayer. In fact, when most of us pray we conclude with the phrase, "in Jesus' name."

Praying in his name is not the same as praying to him. You can pray to the almighty God in the name of Jesus but that does not mean you're praying to Jesus.

[pinkpanther]

ARMAGEDDON

In the Bible, Christ during the Second Coming will establish a New Earth, as well as a New Jerusalem (Revelation 22:3-5).

In Islam, the returning Jesus will destroy the Christian Nations (“break the cross”), abolish Christian practice (“kill the pigs”), and convert everybody to Islam, so that there will be no more need for the Jizya, a.k.a. “Infidel Tax”

Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Apostle said, "The Hour will not be established until the son of Mary [i.e., Jesus] descends amongst you as a just ruler, he will break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the Jizya tax. Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it [as charitable gifts].”

— Sahih al-Bukhari volume 3, book 43, hadith 656

Which side of that End-Times Battle will you be on?

[pinkpanther]

Jesus came down to kill the pigs? Wild hogs hunting BBQ pork? How funny can the moslems make such claims...lol
Abolish the jizya tax? Lol...which countries are still imposing jizya...

[Lukongsimi]

That moslem is not well read...Stephen prayed to who?

Acts 7:59-60
New International Version
59 While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60 Then he fell on his knees and cried out, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” When he had said this, he fell asleep

Philippians 2:10-11 New King James Version (NKJV)
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Yes. 
 Amen!

[pinkpanther]

Yes. 
 Amen!

That stupiak fellow likes to make a fool of himself 

[Ali Imran]

Yes. 
 Amen!

The question I posed to SimTan is simple. Show me where Jesus taught people to pray to him.

SimTan cannot show me. Do you think your friend is smarter than SimTan?

[pinkpanther]

Jesus did not instruct His followers to pray to Him.. instead, He taught them to pray to the Father, remember Jesus emphasized that He and the Father are one.

 If He had encouraged Gentiles to pray to Him, many would have found it hard to believe, much like when the Pharisees sought to stone Him for asserting His unity with the Father.....Jesus exemplified humility in His teachings.

In Acts 7:59, Stephen did pray to Jesus, this is clear evident that He is God and early Christians also directed their prayers to Him, believing in His dual nature as both fully human and fully divine....

Just as your wife may not need to tell you verbally she wants sex but you can tell by body signs  ... Jesus doesn’t have to instruct His followers to pray to Him directly.

[Lukongsimi]

That stupiak fellow likes to make a fool of himself 

He tot he is God sent ?

[Ali Imran]

He tot he is God sent ?

LOL

Why do you think so highly of me? I am definitely not God sent.

But I am a follower of the one Jesus said will come after him and will teach people the full picture, which Jesus couldn't do. 

If Jesus never taught people to pray to him, why do you do that? Don't you know that you are breaking the very first commandment by praying to Jesus?

[Lukongsimi]

Jesus did not instruct His followers to pray to Him.. instead, He taught them to pray to the Father, remember Jesus emphasized that He and the Father are one.

 If He had encouraged Gentiles to pray to Him, many would have found it hard to believe, much like when the Pharisees sought to stone Him for asserting His unity with the Father.....Jesus exemplified humility in His teachings.

In Acts 7:59, Stephen did pray to Jesus, this is clear evident that He is God and early Christians also directed their prayers to Him, believing in His dual nature as both fully human and fully divine....

Just as your wife may not need to tell you verbally she wants sex but you can tell by body signs  ... Jesus doesn’t have to instruct His followers to pray to Him directly.

Nobody can cleanse our sin except God Himself 
In order to do it He has to come down as Human born of a woman n Holy Spirit.
to live as man die for man Sin to unite us to God who created us.

The laws can’t save us. God was grieved that He created Humans n He got to do something to save us.
On earth Jesus can’t claim He is God people will kill him bef the cruxifiction..
Will spoil his plan. 

He gave hints to let us know He is God.
Only His Sheep understands His words
The Goats will keep asking for proof. 😊

[Ali Imran]

Nobody can cleanse our sin except God Himself 
In order to do it He has to come down as Human born of a woman n Holy Spirit.
to live as man die for man Sin to unite us to God who created us.

The laws can’t save us. God was grieved that He created Humans n He got to do something to save us.
On earth Jesus can’t claim He is God people will kill him bef the cruxifiction..
Will spoil his plan. 

He gave hints to let us know He is God.
Only His Sheep understands His words
The Goats will keep asking for proof. 😊

What about during Moses's time? Or Ezekiel's time? Or David's time? How did God erase sins then?

What about the baptism John the Baptist was doing to erase sins?

[Ali Imran]

He gave hints to let us know He is God.
Only His Sheep understands His words
The Goats will keep asking for proof. 😊

Hints? Why hints? Many people don't get hints. 

And if they could not get the hint, they are thrown into hell. That is so unfair to the people who cannot understand hints because God created them like that, having a straight mind that cannot understand hints.

Think pengyu. Use your brain which God has given you.

[pinkpanther]

He tot he is God sent ?

He is the rubbish trụck sent...

[Lukongsimi]

“He said to me: “It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give water without cost from the spring of the water of life. Those who are victorious will inherit all this, and I will be their God and they will be my children. But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.””
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭21‬:‭6‬-‭8‬ ‭NIV

[Lukongsimi]

He is the rubbish trụck sent...

😂

[pinkpanther]

Stephen prayed to Jesus ..so the moslem lost the argument...Jesus is God .the moslems are taught to believe in our scriptures according to the articles of faith....

One who submits to the only God is a moslem is the original message....why then does one needs to acknowledge the prophet? I believe that the original message had been amended and the Shahada is no longer trustworthy

[pinkpanther]

It is nonsense

[Lukongsimi]

Jesus came down to kill the pigs? Wild hogs hunting BBQ pork? How funny can the moslems make such claims...lol
Abolish the jizya tax? Lol...which countries are still imposing jizya...

Anti christ becomes pig?

[S I M T A N]

Praying in his name is not the same as praying to him. You can pray to the almighty God in the name of Jesus but that does not mean you're praying to Jesus.

Jesus's claim to deity by requesting prayer in His name and to Him is understood by His committed followers (Acts 7:59) Only God is worthy of worship. The congregants of my churches - Church of S'pore and New Creation - address God in their worship and prayer services as Almighty God, Dear God, Lord Jesus, Gracious Father, Lord of all life, Christ, Loving Father.

Your relentless questioning and erroneous statement apropos of this issue show your intolerance toward Christians who pray to the Lord Jesus. By your own admission, you have difficulty grasping the holy trinity. We believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ but you don't.

The natural people - those whose minds have not been enlightened by the Holy Spirit - scoff at us. What we do doesn't always seem logical to them. The Bible tells us the natural or carnal mind doesn't understand spiritual things (1 Cor 2:14). It's difficult for their finite minds and hardened hearts to grasp and believe. A hardened heart relates closely to spiritual blindness, for it's with the heart that we perceive spiritually.

[S I M T A N]

Nobody can cleanse our sin except God Himself 
In order to do it He has to come down as Human born of a woman n Holy Spirit.
to live as man die for man Sin to unite us to God who created us.

The laws can’t save us. God was grieved that He created Humans n He got to do something to save us.
On earth Jesus can’t claim He is God people will kill him bef the cruxifiction..
Will spoil his plan. 

He gave hints to let us know He is God.
Only His Sheep understands His words
The Goats will keep asking for proof. 😊

What about during Moses's time? Or Ezekiel's time? Or David's time? How did God erase sins then?

What about the baptism John the Baptist was doing to erase sins?

You're right in saying that only God can cleanse us of our sins. Jesus not only assumed the titles of deity, but claimed for Himself the prerogatives of God. He said to a paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven" (Mark 2:5). The scribes correctly responded, "Who can forgive sins but God alone?" (v. 7). So, to prove that His claim wasn't an empty boast, He healed the man, offering direct proof that what He had said about forgiving sins was true too (v. 8-12).

Another prerogative that Jesus claimed was the power to raise and judge the dead, "Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live... and will come forth.." (John 5:25). He removed all doubt about His meaning when He added, "For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes" (v. 21).

Jesus also claimed that He should be honored as God. He said that all people should "honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He who doesn't honor the Son doesn't honor the Father (John 5:23）。

[Ali Imran]

You're right in saying that only God can cleanse us of our sins. Jesus not only assumed the titles of deity, but claimed for Himself the prerogatives of God. He said to a paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven" (Mark 2:5). The scribes correctly responded, "Who can forgive sins but God alone?" (v. 7). So, to prove that His claim wasn't an empty boast, He healed the man, offering direct proof that what He had said about forgiving sins was true too (v. 8-12).

Another prerogative that Jesus claimed was the power to raise and judge the dead, "Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live... and will come forth.." (John 5:25). He removed all doubt about His meaning when He added, "For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes" (v. 21).

Jesus also claimed that He should be honored as God. He said that all people should "honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He who doesn't honor the Son doesn't honor the Father (John 5:23）。

Hi SimTan

You totally ignored my question. Let me repeat it and if you cannot answer, it will just add to the list of questions that you have trouble explaining.

For so long, God has been forgiving and erasing sins without any need for killing an innocent man. Why suddenly change? What causes God to lose the ability God once had to forgive and erase sins? Why does God suddenly need to be unjust to forgive and erase sins? Yes, it is unjust to kill an innocent man for the wrongdoings of others.

[Ali Imran]

Jesus also claimed that He should be honored as God. He said that all people should "honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He who doesn't honor the Son doesn't honor the Father (John 5:23）。

Yes, we honor the messenger God sent for us. But Jesus, peace be upon him, as God's messenger, wasn't sent for us. Jesus clearly said he was sent for the lost sheep of the house of Israel. It is in the NT. I didn't make that up.

[Ali Imran]

Jesus's claim to deity by requesting prayer in His name and to Him is understood by His committed followers (Acts 7:59) Only God is worthy of worship. The congregants of my churches - Church of S'pore and New Creation - address God in their worship and prayer services as Almighty God, Dear God, Lord Jesus, Gracious Father, Lord of all life, Christ, Loving Father.

Your relentless questioning and erroneous statement apropos of this issue show your intolerance toward Christians who pray to the Lord Jesus. By your own admission, you have difficulty grasping the holy trinity. We believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ but you don't.

The natural people - those whose minds have not been enlightened by the Holy Spirit - scoff at us. What we do doesn't always seem logical to them. The Bible tells us the natural or carnal mind doesn't understand spiritual things (1 Cor 2:14). It's difficult for their finite minds and hardened hearts to grasp and believe. A hardened heart relates closely to spiritual blindness, for it's with the heart that we perceive spiritually.

Please show me where Jesus requested prayer in his name. From my reading of the Bible, I understand Jesus taught people to pray, not requested people to pray. I see a lot of difference between request and teach.

And no, Jesus didn't teach people to pray to him. One guy here is unable to understand that simple argument. 

Please show me one erroneous statement of mine. If you can show me it is erroneous, I will be glad to stand correct.

[Ali Imran]

You're right in saying that only God can cleanse us of our sins. Jesus not only assumed the titles of deity, but claimed for Himself the prerogatives of God. He said to a paralytic, "Son, your sins are forgiven" (Mark 2:5). The scribes correctly responded, "Who can forgive sins but God alone?" (v. 7). So, to prove that His claim wasn't an empty boast, He healed the man, offering direct proof that what He had said about forgiving sins was true too (v. 8-12).

Can you see the difference between "your sins are forgiven" and "I forgive your sins"? Jesus, according to the Gospels, said the former but not the latter. A Pharisee assumed the latter and you went along with the Pharisee.

There is another place where the Christians sided with the Pharisees instead of Jesus. It is when the Pharisees accused Jesus of claiming to be God. Many times in my discourse with Christians, they will use that altercation in trying to prove Jesus is God. They sided with the Pharisees, forgetting that Jesus refuted the Pharisees's accusation. 

Why can't Christians see that? The answer is cognitive dissonance.

[Ali Imran]

Your relentless questioning and erroneous statement apropos of this issue show your intolerance toward Christians who pray to the Lord Jesus. By your own admission, you have difficulty grasping the holy trinity. We believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ but you don't.

It doesn't affect me even the slightest that you worship the son of Mary, a human. I don't need to tolerate anything. I like arguing for the truth and I believe I have truth on my side.

All, and I really mean all, Christians will have difficulty grasping the concept of the Trinity. St Jerome said, in one of his homilies, that it is easier to empty the ocean into a bucket than to explain the Trinity. If you think you understand the Trinity, that means you are not employing critical thinking. I can prove that to you with critical questions, but not using this forum where you only come in once every 24 hours, which makes it tedious and we lose the momentum of the discourse. If you can be here in the day, we can have a rapid back-and-forth, an intensive discourse.

I sleep at night.

[cheekopekman]

Please show me where Jesus requested prayer in his name. From my reading of the Bible, I understand Jesus taught people to pray, not requested people to pray. I see a lot of difference between request and teach.

And no, Jesus didn't teach people to pray to him. One guy here is unable to understand that simple argument. 

Please show me one erroneous statement of mine. If you can show me it is erroneous, I will be glad to stand correct.

"Until now you have not asked for anything in my name. Ask and you will receive, and your joy will be complete." (John 16:24 NIV) Maybe you didn't read this verse lah!