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(09-04-2025, 11:32 AM)pinkpanther Wrote: Yes lah...Salvation is a gift from God, not something earned through good works, but received through faith in Jesus Christ lah
(09-04-2025, 12:01 PM)Lukongsimi Wrote: If works can save sinners then Jesus needless to born as man to save the world
(09-04-2025, 08:56 PM)cheekopekman Wrote: We are saved by grace through faith, not by works lah!
(10-04-2025, 01:38 AM)S I M T A N Wrote: With Allah, along with the god of Joseph Smith (Mormonism) and Charles Taze Russell (Jehovah's Witnesses), just to name a few, heaven can only be reached by way of works. It makes sense that a god created in their image would require them to work and strive, obey and toil, to earn the forgiveness that eludes them all. Indeed, no one dares to attack these servants of their religions living such a godly life even as they try to produce a righteousness of their own instead of appropriating the righteousness of Christ (Gal 2:21).
Grace isn't something they understand or extend fundamentally. It's a foreign concept that has come to us by way of Jesus who's the embodiment of heaven coming to earth so that the guilty can be declared innocent on the basis of grace and grace alone. He made it so that the only object the undeserving have to offer in exchange for pardon is faith. Arranging salvation this way is incomprehensible, different from the way any other god would set up the way of redemption. "Who is a God like you, who pardons iniquity and passes over the transgression of the remnant of His inheritance - who does not retain His anger forever, because He delights in loving devotion?" (Mic. 7:18)
Justification - the transformation of a sinner into a genuine saint - is intended to make possible a relationship with God, impossible between a sinner and a holy God. Reception of forgiveness is meant to be followed by reception of holiness. Justification is the means, sanctification the end. In every other religion it's the other way round: a holy life must be lived in order to be accepted by God. The good news of the gospel is that God accepts us as we are - in order to live a holy life.
This is the core of what Christianity is all about. The essence of theology is grace, and without an understanding of it we cannot possibly understand what Christianity is.
We deserve to die if we don't believe in Jesus and accept Him as Lord and Saviour, but through faith we believe and by God's grace we need not die in eternity lah! You're right bro, grace isn't something easily understood lah!
(10-04-2025, 12:47 PM)cheekopekman Wrote: When you see Him face to face 1 day you will know lah!
(10-04-2025, 01:38 AM)S I M T A N Wrote: With Allah, along with the god of Joseph Smith (Mormonism) and Charles Taze Russell (Jehovah's Witnesses), just to name a few, heaven can only be reached by way of works. It makes sense that a god created in their image would require them to work and strive, obey and toil, to earn the forgiveness that eludes them all. Indeed, no one dares to attack these servants of their religions living such a godly life even as they try to produce a righteousness of their own instead of appropriating the righteousness of Christ (Gal 2:21).
Grace isn't something they understand or extend fundamentally. It's a foreign concept that has come to us by way of Jesus who's the embodiment of heaven coming to earth so that the guilty can be declared innocent on the basis of grace and grace alone. He made it so that the only object the undeserving have to offer in exchange for pardon is faith. Arranging salvation this way is incomprehensible, different from the way any other god would set up the way of redemption. "Who is a God like you, who pardons iniquity and passes over the transgression of the remnant of His inheritance - who does not retain His anger forever, because He delights in loving devotion?" (Mic. 7:18)
Justification - the transformation of a sinner into a genuine saint - is intended to make possible a relationship with God, impossible between a sinner and a holy God. Reception of forgiveness is meant to be followed by reception of holiness. Justification is the means, sanctification the end. In every other religion it's the other way round: a holy life must be lived in order to be accepted by God. The good news of the gospel is that God accepts us as we are - in order to live a holy life.
This is the core of what Christianity is all about. The essence of theology is grace, and without an understanding of it we cannot possibly understand what Christianity is.
(09-04-2025, 12:59 AM)S I M T A N Wrote: When you do a headcount of the number of active Christian debaters here, there are of course 3 distinct individuals and not one persona in yours truly. But that's too simplistic an interpretation of the God of the Scripture. When you consider that man's spirit, soul, and body constitute the complete human personality - which correspond to the three components of the Trinity - you get the gist of it.
Despite believers having provided you with more than enough information on the Holy Trinity, you have decidedly rejected it, understandably so because Allah isn't triune. To say that God has a Son, as the Bible does, is an unforgiveable sin known as shirk to Muslims.
You admitted to not being able to grasp the doctrine of the Holy Trinity. The Scripture has an explanation for it. "Thinking ourselves to be wise, we become fools (1 Cor 1:18-27; 3:18; Rom 1:22). This is typical of what Scripture calls "the natural person," also known as the dead one (1 Cor 2:14; Eph 2:15; 4:8). "The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they're spiritually discerned" (1 Cor 2:14).
It's not because of ignorance that people will not ask God's forgiveness, but blindness. As the heart is, the mind is too, both darkened and incapable of functioning correctly or behaving righteously (Rom 1:21). The complete deadness of the heart and mind is what makes obedience to God's moral law impossible. God's hatred of sin didn't keep Him from loving us, but He chose on His own accord to rescue us from the wrath to come.
(10-04-2025, 06:37 AM)cheekopekman Wrote: Grace is a gift of God that we don't deserve lah!
Are moslems still following this law anymore? (10-04-2025, 10:13 PM)Ali Imran Wrote: If you believe in God (faith), obey God's commandments (work). That is the teachings of the biblical prophets, including Jesus.
Why do you believe differently?
When we're saved, we're taught to do good works to glorify the Lord lah! Jesus existed long before any prophet was born lah!
(11-04-2025, 06:14 AM)cheekopekman Wrote: Ali my friend, we're saved by grace through faith and not work lah!
(11-04-2025, 01:40 AM)S I M T A N Wrote: The Bible introduces the triune Godhead in Genesis 1:1-2: "In the beginning God created... And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters." The Holy Spirit moved with creative power on behalf of the Godhead, and this creative role carried through the formation of the earth and everything in it.
Genesis 1:3 says, "God says, 'Let there be light; and there was light." Psalm 33:6 tells us, "By the word of the Lord the heavens were made, and all the host of them by the breath (Spirit) of His mouth." God's creative power was channeled through His word and His Spirit, which executed His pronouncement.
God is one, and yet He is more than one; He is simultaneously plural and singular. This truth is immediately introduced to us by the first 3 words of the Bible and runs throughout the Scriptures, shedding light on God's triune identity. There are lots of other passages throughout the Bible ascribing to the Holy Trinity. I'm sure you know where they are. With many decades of theological debates behind you, you surely don't need me to spoon-feed you, do
you?
(11-04-2025, 11:09 AM)Lukongsimi Wrote: “In fact, the law requires that nearly everything be cleansed with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.”
Hebrews 9:22 NIV
(11-04-2025, 11:41 AM)pinkpanther Wrote: The Moslems still carry out this yearly ritual as a demonstration of their obedience to God, leading to the sacrifice of millions of lambs.....
The lambs plead with God, "Is there no way for us to be excluded from their religious practices?"
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